Episode 57
E57: To Quote an Expert: “Using Someone Else’s IP Might Cost You.”
As I talk to my listeners about their journey from Hourly to Exit, I assume they will be building Intellectual Property (IP) assets to sell to clients and the public. Well, unless you figured out how to reinvent the wheel, you may be inspired by or even using materials that another expert in your field created. Giving that person credit and promoting their book is the right thing to do, but it may not be enough. You may need to ask for permission.
In this episode of Hourly to Exit, I cover some critical points about getting permission to use someone else’s copyrighted materials, including:
- Understanding the nature of the copyrighted material as an asset the owner can use for profit
- The process for securing permission, including finding the actual owner (hint, the author isn’t always the owner!).
- Why it’s essential to get permission in “writing,” which has specific formalities more complex than you’d think.
- BONUS: We take a brief detour into the fascinating world of filmmaking.
For any expert with a service-based business, it’s critical to build your reputation and your IP inventory on a solid foundation. Getting the correct permissions is an important step. If you aren’t sure about whether you can use something in your materials, contact me for a consultation.
Connect with Erin to learn how to use intellectual property to increase your income and impact. hourlytoexit.com/podcast.
Erin's LinkedIn Page: https://www.linkedin.com/in/erinaustin/
Think Beyond IP YouTube Page: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCVztXnDYnZ83oIb-EGX9IGA/videos
Music credit: Yes She Can by Tiny Music
A Team Dklutr production
Transcript
Hello ladies.
Speaker:Welcome to this week's
Speaker:episode of Hourly to Exit.
Speaker:Today we're gonna talk about
Speaker:what happens if you want to
Speaker:use a thought leader's book
Speaker:in your course or workshop.
Speaker:Now, I've received this
Speaker:question a few times
Speaker:recently, so I wanted to.
Speaker:Pop in and have a
Speaker:conversation about that.
Speaker:Now, for some of you, someone
Speaker:has literally written the
Speaker:book on the topic that
Speaker:you wanna cover in your
Speaker:course or workshop, so
Speaker:it makes sense to you to
Speaker:use, portions of the text.
Speaker:Maybe there's some examples
Speaker:in there, some insights
Speaker:for you to put it on slides
Speaker:or to incorporate it into
Speaker:the accompanying workbook.
Speaker:you would very happily give
Speaker:the thought leader credit.
Speaker:You would also encourage
Speaker:everyone to buy the book since
Speaker:you personally believe that it
Speaker:is required reading for anyone
Speaker:doing work in your space.
Speaker:So that would be fair, right?
Speaker:They'd get credit.
Speaker:You'd encourage everyone
Speaker:to buy the book.
Speaker:Of course, I cannot
Speaker:answer that for you
Speaker:because that would be
Speaker:giving you legal advice.
Speaker:So whether or not you
Speaker:can use someone else's
Speaker:material without asking for
Speaker:permission is fact specific.
Speaker:By that, it means.
Speaker:If and how you can use
Speaker:somebody else's material
Speaker:depends entirely on
Speaker:the specific facts
Speaker:related to your use.
Speaker:So that can only be determined
Speaker:on a one-on-one business after
Speaker:looking at the totality of the
Speaker:issues surrounding the use.
Speaker:However, because it comes
Speaker:up so often, I am going
Speaker:to give you a mini lecture
Speaker:and then I will talk about
Speaker:how to get permission to
Speaker:use a book in your course.
Speaker:So I wanna start by
Speaker:separating this use from
Speaker:teachers in a classroom.
Speaker:People will often refer
Speaker:to their experience,
Speaker:being in the classroom, at
Speaker:college level, typically,
Speaker:in academic setting.
Speaker:And that, frequently they'll
Speaker:get handouts that include,
Speaker:other people's work.
Speaker:So this does not apply to you.
Speaker:This does not apply to your
Speaker:expertise based business.
Speaker:You are.
Speaker:Leading workshops or
Speaker:teaching courses for profit.
Speaker:This is your business.
Speaker:This is a commercial
Speaker:use, not an academic
Speaker:use or educational use.
Speaker:So that, use by teachers
Speaker:in the classroom is not
Speaker:applicable to your use.
Speaker:Secondly, I wanna make sure
Speaker:that we don't ignore the
Speaker:realness of the items that
Speaker:you get off the internet.
Speaker:intellectual property
Speaker:rights are assets.
Speaker:I know you know this 'cause
Speaker:I'm always telling you.
Speaker:but, Still, there's something
Speaker:about being able to download
Speaker:something off the internet,
Speaker:without paying for it,
Speaker:that somehow people aren't
Speaker:completely understanding
Speaker:the real, ability to possess
Speaker:something that you can
Speaker:download off the internet.
Speaker:So intellectual property
Speaker:rights, I mean, they
Speaker:are real assets.
Speaker:They are owned and registered.
Speaker:They can be bought and sold.
Speaker:They can be
Speaker:licensed or loaned.
Speaker:They can be divided.
Speaker:They can even be inherited.
Speaker:So in our particular
Speaker:circumstance, when we're
Speaker:talking about books, we're
Speaker:talking about copyrights,
Speaker:is the specific type of
Speaker:intellectual property rights
Speaker:that we're talking about.
Speaker:So as a brief refresher,
Speaker:copyright protection
Speaker:grants, the owner, the
Speaker:exclusive rights to do
Speaker:all of the following.
Speaker:To reproduce the work, i
Speaker:e make copies to create
Speaker:derivative works such
Speaker:as, turning a book into
Speaker:a movie, distribute
Speaker:copies to the public.
Speaker:That means like to
Speaker:sell it to the public.
Speaker:Perform the work, take
Speaker:a play and it on stage.
Speaker:Display the work publicly,
Speaker:like artwork or transmit
Speaker:the work publicly, such
Speaker:as over the airwaves.
Speaker:And you also have the
Speaker:exclusive right to authorize
Speaker:anyone else to exercise
Speaker:any of those rights.
Speaker:So that would be
Speaker:such as a license, a
Speaker:publishing agreement, a
Speaker:distribution agreement.
Speaker:intellectual property rights
Speaker:that the copyright owner of
Speaker:that book are just as much
Speaker:of an asset to that owner as
Speaker:their car or their house, they
Speaker:have just as much right to the
Speaker:exclusive use of their car.
Speaker:Or their house as they
Speaker:do to their intellectual
Speaker:property rights.
Speaker:So I want you to think
Speaker:about the exception to
Speaker:those exclusive rights as
Speaker:narrowly as you think about
Speaker:exceptions to exclusive
Speaker:use of your property.
Speaker:I mean, you don't think that,
Speaker:I have exclusive use to my
Speaker:property unless, I'm not gonna
Speaker:notice that you're using it.
Speaker:the exceptions to
Speaker:use of your property.
Speaker:I'm not talking about physical
Speaker:property, would be, you know,
Speaker:Emergencies or some sort of
Speaker:legal action that results
Speaker:in an IMiD domain .Process,
Speaker:but you don't get to use
Speaker:somebody else's property,
Speaker:just because it'd be more
Speaker:convenient or you don't get to
Speaker:use somebody else's property
Speaker:because they're out of town
Speaker:and they'll never notice,
Speaker:or you don't get to use the
Speaker:property because, it's so
Speaker:large that, know, if I just.
Speaker:Go to the back of their
Speaker:property and do some hunting.
Speaker:No one's ever gonna notice
Speaker:it's still their property.
Speaker:They still have exclusive
Speaker:rights about how that
Speaker:property is used.
Speaker:And the same thing applies to
Speaker:intellectual property assets.
Speaker:Someone owns the rights
Speaker:to exploit it exclusively.
Speaker:So I'm going to use this
Speaker:as an opportunity to talk
Speaker:about my parallels between,
Speaker:inventory in the physical
Speaker:sense of inventory, the kind
Speaker:that you can put on financial
Speaker:statement and the way I like
Speaker:to talk about inventory in our
Speaker:expertise based businesses.
Speaker:So when we look at the.
Speaker:Definition of inventory.
Speaker:We have raw material, we
Speaker:have works in progress,
Speaker:and we have finished goods.
Speaker:And by the way, I did
Speaker:do a deep dive about
Speaker:the parallels, about.
Speaker:Taking inventory of our
Speaker:intellectual property in
Speaker:episode, 53 if you are
Speaker:interested in, in finding out
Speaker:more about that, conversation.
Speaker:But to briefly recap
Speaker:it, I talk about, the
Speaker:raw materials in our
Speaker:expertise based business.
Speaker:Those are the foundational
Speaker:parts of our expertise.
Speaker:So those are original ideas
Speaker:and the firsthand experiences
Speaker:that we have, probably as an
Speaker:employee, as we're growing
Speaker:our area of expertise.
Speaker:As we go out on our own,
Speaker:the client work will
Speaker:help build our expertise.
Speaker:We might get certifications,
Speaker:we'll do trainings,
Speaker:continuing education.
Speaker:Maybe we do our own research
Speaker:and even the work that we
Speaker:engage subcontractors to do.
Speaker:' cause a lot of times we'll
Speaker:have a subcontractor who knows
Speaker:something better than we do,
Speaker:'cause that's their expertise.
Speaker:And so all these things
Speaker:are the raw materials
Speaker:that are the foundational
Speaker:parts of our expertise.
Speaker:And then we move on to
Speaker:our works in progress.
Speaker:So as we develop our
Speaker:expertise, we start to notice
Speaker:patterns and we start to
Speaker:create internal resources
Speaker:so we can be, more efficient
Speaker:and more predictable
Speaker:in the results that we
Speaker:deliver to our clients.
Speaker:So these are things
Speaker:like our system and, and
Speaker:processes, SOPs, templates,
Speaker:frameworks, and methodologies
Speaker:that we use internally.
Speaker:Those are our
Speaker:works in progress.
Speaker:And then we have our
Speaker:finished products.
Speaker:When we develop our expertise
Speaker:to the point that we're ready
Speaker:to graduate from one-on-one
Speaker:services to creating scalable
Speaker:revenue streams, and we create
Speaker:those finished products.
Speaker:I look at that as our
Speaker:finished product inventory.
Speaker:So those are things that
Speaker:we are selling externally,
Speaker:like group training
Speaker:and courses and books.
Speaker:templates that we're selling
Speaker:and when we're licensing
Speaker:our expertise as well.
Speaker:So from an inventory
Speaker:perspective, the thought
Speaker:leader's book, that is
Speaker:her finished product.
Speaker:It is the culmination of her
Speaker:. Expertise and she's used
Speaker:it to package it into a
Speaker:new revenue stream that
Speaker:she is selling for profit.
Speaker:And so, It reminds me of the
Speaker:Picasso example where we've
Speaker:all heard this one where
Speaker:someone comes up to him in
Speaker:a restaurant and they ask
Speaker:him to a drawing on a napkin
Speaker:and he does a little drawing
Speaker:and then he charges her, a
Speaker:million bucks, I guess it is.
Speaker:And like, why you just,
Speaker:wrote that on a napkin.
Speaker:Well, it's, the reason I was
Speaker:able to do that is 'cause I
Speaker:spent a lifetime perfecting
Speaker:my craft, and that's what
Speaker:thought leader's book is
Speaker:a career of perfecting her
Speaker:craft and putting it into
Speaker:this finished product.
Speaker:And so she's earned the
Speaker:right to the exclusive
Speaker:use of that product.
Speaker:And that same book when it
Speaker:is in your hands, is raw
Speaker:material for your inventory.
Speaker:It is something that
Speaker:you are going to be
Speaker:using as an influence.
Speaker:or at literally an element
Speaker:of your course or workshop.
Speaker:So, whether we're using
Speaker:it as an influence is a
Speaker:separate conversation.
Speaker:If you literally want to use
Speaker:parts of her book in your
Speaker:course or workshop, then that
Speaker:is the same as, the steering
Speaker:wheel in a car, like you don't
Speaker:get to get the parts for your
Speaker:finished product for free.
Speaker:You do need to pay for that.
Speaker:That is a cost of
Speaker:doing business.
Speaker:I don't think there is any
Speaker:scenario where we would
Speaker:think that if it was a
Speaker:physical product that we
Speaker:would be able to take someone
Speaker:else's finished product.
Speaker:So if I am a screw
Speaker:manufacturer, screws are my
Speaker:finished product and I make,
Speaker:cars and I need their screw.
Speaker:So their finished product
Speaker:is my raw material.
Speaker:I pay for that raw
Speaker:material to include in
Speaker:my finished product.
Speaker:so, I want us to think about
Speaker:other people's finished
Speaker:products in the same way
Speaker:when we are using them as raw
Speaker:materials for our finished
Speaker:products there's my lecture.
Speaker:So think about, do you
Speaker:really think it would be
Speaker:reasonable to use somebody
Speaker:else's finished product?
Speaker:As raw materials for our
Speaker:finished products and
Speaker:generally, you know, I'm an
Speaker:intellectual profit lawyer.
Speaker:I am going to say what you
Speaker:need to do for the most part,
Speaker:and there will always be
Speaker:exceptions, but for the most
Speaker:part, you need to purchase the
Speaker:right to acquire the right.
Speaker:It may not cost you anything,
Speaker:but it probably will acquire
Speaker:the right to use somebody
Speaker:else's finished product as
Speaker:a raw material for yours.
Speaker:So securing permission is
Speaker:really the only way you can
Speaker:ensure that the intended use
Speaker:is not an infringement of
Speaker:the copyright owner's rights.
Speaker:I mentioned fair use briefly.
Speaker:I never teach people
Speaker:how to use fair use.
Speaker:Fair use is a defense.
Speaker:So, I will say, when I
Speaker:was in the film business,
Speaker:I, was a motion picture
Speaker:lawyer for about 10 years,
Speaker:and we would have to
Speaker:make fair use judgements
Speaker:as we were shooting.
Speaker:let's say we're shooting
Speaker:inside of a, grocery store,
Speaker:and so your characters
Speaker:are walking through the
Speaker:aisles, you're not going
Speaker:to clear every single, box
Speaker:of cereal and, soda that
Speaker:shows up on screen as your
Speaker:characters walk through
Speaker:the aisles, but you will.
Speaker:So we would have to make fair
Speaker:use judgements about, what was
Speaker:on screen in the background.
Speaker:What could we use?
Speaker:I.
Speaker:As a fair use and what
Speaker:we would either need
Speaker:to secure the rights
Speaker:to use or to blur out.
Speaker:Sometimes you shoot something
Speaker:and then it comes out later.
Speaker:We would do, this
Speaker:is a little aside.
Speaker:We would look at
Speaker:dailies every day.
Speaker:We would see what
Speaker:was shot that day.
Speaker:And as the production lawyer,
Speaker:you had to look through the
Speaker:dailies and make sure that
Speaker:anything that appeared on
Speaker:screen was cleared for use.
Speaker:So if you, got the dailies,
Speaker:you didn't know that they
Speaker:were gonna do something,
Speaker:that day, and then you
Speaker:get the dailies like
Speaker:what, the main characters.
Speaker:stands right in front
Speaker:of the cereal aisle and
Speaker:clear as day, or, corn
Speaker:Flakes and, Cheerios, and
Speaker:they're having an argument.
Speaker:even the context
Speaker:sometimes mattered.
Speaker:if something wonderful is
Speaker:happening, then something
Speaker:terrible is happening.
Speaker:Like, eh, maybe you
Speaker:have to blur it, you
Speaker:and you can't use it.
Speaker:All that to say is that,
Speaker:once again, fair use,
Speaker:extremely fact specific,
Speaker:and it's something that
Speaker:needs to be looked at
Speaker:after you have all the
Speaker:facts in place and you know
Speaker:what's gonna happen there.
Speaker:It's not something that
Speaker:can be judged upfront.
Speaker:All right.
Speaker:So with that in mind,
Speaker:if you're going to use
Speaker:anybody else's materials,
Speaker:anyone else's materials
Speaker:in yours, then you
Speaker:should secure permission.
Speaker:So what's the
Speaker:process for that?
Speaker:First, you want to find out
Speaker:is it in fact protected?
Speaker:Now, if you're talking about
Speaker:a current thought leader,
Speaker:and I'm assuming these are.
Speaker:Current thought leaders
Speaker:books, then the likelihood
Speaker:is extremely high that
Speaker:book is eligible for
Speaker:copyright protection.
Speaker:But you know, as a formality,
Speaker:we would confirm that,
Speaker:maybe it's something from
Speaker:before, like, I don't know
Speaker:how long ago was, things
Speaker:like, how to win friends
Speaker:and influence people, like
Speaker:maybe that was published
Speaker:during a time when copyright
Speaker:notices were required
Speaker:and it didn't have one.
Speaker:So back then, if you didn't,
Speaker:literally didn't have that,
Speaker:see in a circle and the formal
Speaker:copyright notice on there,
Speaker:you, it wouldn't be protected.
Speaker:So maybe it's something
Speaker:that slipped through
Speaker:the cracks there.
Speaker:Maybe it was published
Speaker:so long ago that the.
Speaker:period of protection has
Speaker:passed and is now in the
Speaker:public domain, or maybe
Speaker:it falls into a category
Speaker:of works that are not
Speaker:copyrightable, like facts
Speaker:or natural phenomenon.
Speaker:so it's possible that, the
Speaker:book or the portions of the
Speaker:book that you wanna reproduce,
Speaker:you, obviously you're not
Speaker:copying the whole thing, but
Speaker:that the portion of the book
Speaker:that you want to reproduce
Speaker:is not copyrightable.
Speaker:but for the purposes of this
Speaker:conversation, let's assume
Speaker:that it is copyrightable
Speaker:and is, protectable.
Speaker:So now you may need
Speaker:to identify the owner.
Speaker:it could be as simple as
Speaker:looking at the title page.
Speaker:So the back of the title page
Speaker:there will be the copyright
Speaker:statement where it will say
Speaker:who the copyright owner is.
Speaker:that's typically found the
Speaker:back of the copyright page.
Speaker:However, that would state
Speaker:who the copyright owner was
Speaker:at the time of publication.
Speaker:That can change a couple
Speaker:of things could be that
Speaker:either the writer who I'm
Speaker:just gonna assume is the
Speaker:thought leader is no longer
Speaker:the copyright owner or never
Speaker:was the copyright owner.
Speaker:So let's say for instance,
Speaker:the thought leader worked for.
Speaker:I b m, maybe it was, I
Speaker:can remember his name,
Speaker:Jack Welsh gm, right?
Speaker:So maybe when he wrote
Speaker:a well-known book and
Speaker:maybe when he wrote it,
Speaker:it was in his role as c
Speaker:e O of General Electric.
Speaker:And General Electric actually
Speaker:owns the copyright in
Speaker:his book, not Jack Welsh.
Speaker:that also may apply, that
Speaker:maybe, I write a novel at, my.
Speaker:Business is Aaron
Speaker:oss la P e l c.
Speaker:And someday, I sell it.
Speaker:And then when I sell
Speaker:my business, maybe I
Speaker:also sell the work that
Speaker:is the underlying, big
Speaker:idea underneath the
Speaker:business that I sell.
Speaker:And so I also sell the
Speaker:copyright in the book,
Speaker:to the acquiring company.
Speaker:So it could be that, the
Speaker:book was written for somebody
Speaker:else as a work for hire, or
Speaker:it was sold in the interim.
Speaker:Or I pass it on to my
Speaker:son when it's time for
Speaker:me to leave this realm.
Speaker:So there are a number of
Speaker:reasons why the copyright
Speaker:owner listed in the
Speaker:book may not, be the
Speaker:current owner as the time
Speaker:that you wanna use it.
Speaker:Another way you can find
Speaker:out is that you can go to
Speaker:the us copyright has public
Speaker:records, and now as you know,
Speaker:not everything is always
Speaker:registered, but if it's been
Speaker:registered and that's been
Speaker:up to date, you search it
Speaker:by title and it will show
Speaker:you who the copyright owner
Speaker:is as of time of searching
Speaker:based on the public records.
Speaker:So we identify who the owner
Speaker:is to the best of our ability.
Speaker:And then we identify what
Speaker:rights do we need, what
Speaker:exactly do we wanna do
Speaker:with the work that we get
Speaker:from the thought leader?
Speaker:So, You'll wanna identify
Speaker:which material you wanna use.
Speaker:And then you look at that
Speaker:bundle of rights, that
Speaker:compromise, copyrights, and
Speaker:we talked about them before,
Speaker:reproduction, distribution,
Speaker:display performance.
Speaker:And so which of those bundle
Speaker:of rights do you need for
Speaker:what you wanna do with it?
Speaker:let's say you wanna be able
Speaker:to make copies, probably
Speaker:if you're gonna include
Speaker:it in your workbooks, and
Speaker:you're gonna distribute
Speaker:that to the participants.
Speaker:Maybe you wanna
Speaker:create a derivative.
Speaker:So maybe you wanna use
Speaker:something that you found
Speaker:in the book to create a
Speaker:script for role-playing.
Speaker:especially like, let's say
Speaker:you're doing role-playing
Speaker:in your workshop, and so
Speaker:you're using that as a script
Speaker:that's creating a derivative.
Speaker:maybe you want to
Speaker:distribute copies of it.
Speaker:So if this is a course that
Speaker:you're selling online, then
Speaker:you would need the right
Speaker:to distribute copies of it.
Speaker:perform the work, display
Speaker:the work, transmit the work.
Speaker:or to authorize a third party
Speaker:to do any of those things,
Speaker:such as if you're creating a
Speaker:workshop that you will license
Speaker:to other people, then you
Speaker:need to be able to, authorize
Speaker:third parties to also make
Speaker:copies, distribute, et cetera.
Speaker:So what rights do you need?
Speaker:And then you need to contact
Speaker:that owner and you may need
Speaker:to negotiate a payment.
Speaker:Hopefully we've found
Speaker:the correct owner and
Speaker:we can contact them.
Speaker:it may be that, yes, the
Speaker:owner of the copyright is
Speaker:still the thought leader, but
Speaker:the thought leader Licensed
Speaker:all of the rights to, give
Speaker:permissions to the publisher.
Speaker:So that's not at all unusual.
Speaker:If you go the traditional
Speaker:publisher route, you sign
Speaker:a publishing deal, the
Speaker:publisher gets exclusive
Speaker:rights to distribute the
Speaker:book, but it also gets what
Speaker:are called ancillary rights,
Speaker:which would include the
Speaker:right to control, you who.
Speaker:gets permission, and the
Speaker:ability to license portions of
Speaker:the book and charge a fee for
Speaker:it, or just give permission,
Speaker:for academic settings, that
Speaker:will often be a right that's
Speaker:granted to the publisher.
Speaker:I.
Speaker:So you may need to go to the
Speaker:publisher for that, which
Speaker:actually, frankly is simpler.
Speaker:and, sometimes there will
Speaker:be, directions right on the
Speaker:copyright page about how
Speaker:to contact the publisher to
Speaker:get rights, cleared for use.
Speaker:And there are also websites
Speaker:that assist in this, one
Speaker:of them, copyright.com.
Speaker:It is a copyright clearance
Speaker:marketplace where you
Speaker:go in there and you
Speaker:search for publications.
Speaker:Let's say there's an article
Speaker:in Forbes Magazine that you
Speaker:wanna use and you can go in
Speaker:there and, if the publication
Speaker:or the publishing house has an
Speaker:arrangement with the copyright
Speaker:clearance, marketplace, then
Speaker:it'll say right there, like,
Speaker:you can license it for us.
Speaker:it'll ask you like what the
Speaker:use will be like, such as
Speaker:business use, and they may
Speaker:already have preset fees.
Speaker:and it'll makes it.
Speaker:Fairly simple.
Speaker:If, you do have a third party,
Speaker:clearance house that can help
Speaker:you with that and then whether
Speaker:or not there is a fee that
Speaker:you might not wanna offer
Speaker:one, but they may ask for one.
Speaker:Right?
Speaker:And then you want to get
Speaker:the permission in writing.
Speaker:the best case scenario is it
Speaker:is original and ink signed.
Speaker:By that I mean, wet signature.
Speaker:Someone's literally printing
Speaker:something out, using a pen
Speaker:and signing it, and you get
Speaker:a copy of that, original
Speaker:ink signed, permission.
Speaker:However, when we're talking
Speaker:about using permissions in
Speaker:our courses or workshops, we
Speaker:are absolutely, asking to use
Speaker:it on a non-exclusive basis.
Speaker:where it's not a transfer of
Speaker:ownership rights of any kind.
Speaker:And so in writing
Speaker:can be by email.
Speaker:you can get non-exclusive
Speaker:license to use copyrighted
Speaker:materials without
Speaker:it being in writing.
Speaker:You can even get it orally.
Speaker:I wouldn't recommend that
Speaker:'cause you wanna definitely
Speaker:have a written record.
Speaker:so having it by email.
Speaker:Would be sufficient.
Speaker:However, I would say that
Speaker:the bigger the investment
Speaker:would be, the more formality
Speaker:you wanna go through.
Speaker:If you're asked to
Speaker:pay a license fee,
Speaker:that's substantial.
Speaker:Obviously, you want to
Speaker:have more formality than if
Speaker:someone says, sure, go ahead.
Speaker:If you're going to be making
Speaker:a substantial investment in
Speaker:resources, let's say you're
Speaker:incorporating it into a book.
Speaker:And then you're gonna go to
Speaker:print with this book, and
Speaker:so there's a big investment.
Speaker:Then you absolutely have more
Speaker:formalities if you're going to
Speaker:making that kind of investment
Speaker:something that you're
Speaker:putting, in a digital course.
Speaker:And not that you shouldn't
Speaker:go through the formalities,
Speaker:you should, but if you're
Speaker:something that's going to
Speaker:go into your course that
Speaker:if something happened
Speaker:and you had to take it
Speaker:out, you don't have to.
Speaker:get a second mortgage on your
Speaker:house in order to do this.
Speaker:Then the formalities
Speaker:should be consistent with
Speaker:the level of investment.
Speaker:You whether or not you have
Speaker:lawyers involved and have
Speaker:things like that consistent
Speaker:with the use, for that item.
Speaker:So, what is the
Speaker:written permission?
Speaker:It can be pretty simple.
Speaker:people think it's
Speaker:gonna be a big deal.
Speaker:It really is not.
Speaker:Again, you could be
Speaker:by email once you know
Speaker:who you're asking.
Speaker:You do wanna make sure you're
Speaker:asking the right person.
Speaker:it doesn't need to be a
Speaker:long, complicated document.
Speaker:Absolutely can be a
Speaker:one pager if it's.
Speaker:In writing, and by
Speaker:then, I mean on paper.
Speaker:but the minimums
Speaker:are fairly simple.
Speaker:you just wanna make sure
Speaker:you have the following.
Speaker:You wanna just say who
Speaker:you are and what you do.
Speaker:You wanna have an accurate but
Speaker:brief, identification of what
Speaker:material exactly you're using.
Speaker:I wanna use the
Speaker:graphic on page 25.
Speaker:or I wanna use the entire,
Speaker:chapter perhaps, And so
Speaker:identify specifically what
Speaker:you want to use, how you're
Speaker:going to use the content.
Speaker:I'm going to be using
Speaker:this in my d e I training.
Speaker:I'm gonna be using this
Speaker:in an evergreen course.
Speaker:I'm gonna be putting this
Speaker:in my book, how you're
Speaker:going to use the content,
Speaker:and where you will use it,
Speaker:you seminar, webinar, et
Speaker:cetera, online, in person.
Speaker:how you're gonna use it,
Speaker:and then for how long you're
Speaker:gonna use the content.
Speaker:So how long you're gonna use
Speaker:it is gonna be very different.
Speaker:if you're giving a, a speech,
Speaker:at a conference versus if
Speaker:you're going to be creating
Speaker:an evergreen course that's
Speaker:gonna be available online
Speaker:for, as long as the material
Speaker:is useful and relevant.
Speaker:and, know, whether or
Speaker:not you offer payment
Speaker:that will be your choice.
Speaker:if you don't, and the rights
Speaker:holder may request payment,
Speaker:and that will be an analysis
Speaker:for you to, understand the
Speaker:value of having this material
Speaker:included, against what
Speaker:they're asking you to pay.
Speaker:So it may turn out that
Speaker:it doesn't make sense from
Speaker:a financial perspective.
Speaker:and if you do ask for it by
Speaker:email and you do want the full
Speaker:formalities, you can still
Speaker:send it by email, ask them
Speaker:to print it out, ask them to
Speaker:sign it and return it to you.
Speaker:and scanned copy
Speaker:would be fine.
Speaker:so long as it's not a
Speaker:transfer of ownership,
Speaker:in which case you'd want
Speaker:an original copying.
Speaker:All right, so, When you're,
Speaker:creating a course using
Speaker:somebody else's book, if you
Speaker:do it without permission, it
Speaker:could result in legal action.
Speaker:worst case scenario of course
Speaker:is someone be suing you.
Speaker:Almost nobody starts there.
Speaker:Almost everyone starts
Speaker:with a cease and desist.
Speaker:but that's not something
Speaker:that you wanna have happen.
Speaker:you will have invested.
Speaker:Time and resources in
Speaker:creating your workshop,
Speaker:creating your course.
Speaker:Before you put in those
Speaker:investments, you wanna
Speaker:make sure that you
Speaker:have permission to use
Speaker:everything that is in there.
Speaker:And in addition to
Speaker:losing those resources
Speaker:that you've committed,
Speaker:let's say you have to.
Speaker:Claw it back from someone
Speaker:that you've sold it to.
Speaker:What if you have to tell
Speaker:a client that you have,
Speaker:let's say you've licensed
Speaker:your workshop to them for
Speaker:them to use throughout
Speaker:their organization, and
Speaker:now you have to retract
Speaker:permission for that.
Speaker:How mortifying would that be?
Speaker:And so I just want you to,
Speaker:take a conservative view
Speaker:if you're going to use
Speaker:somebody else's materials.
Speaker:To make money for this to
Speaker:be an important part of
Speaker:your business, something
Speaker:that you are selling to your
Speaker:clients, something that you're
Speaker:building your reputation on.
Speaker:You want to make sure that you
Speaker:have the rights to that and
Speaker:that it's not going to be a
Speaker:source of either legal risk or
Speaker:reputational risk because you
Speaker:haven't cleared those things.
Speaker:So make sure you do that.
Speaker:And, just one other thing
Speaker:is that, if you're selling
Speaker:the course on a third party
Speaker:platform, they may have their
Speaker:own requirements for you
Speaker:to make statements about,
Speaker:what you can put on there.
Speaker:Um, cause they don't wanna
Speaker:get involved with, take down
Speaker:notices and things like that.
Speaker:and so, Once again, making
Speaker:sure that everything that
Speaker:you, incorporate into
Speaker:your courses, into your
Speaker:workshops that you're gonna
Speaker:be using to generate income
Speaker:that they are cleared.
Speaker:I hope this was
Speaker:helpful to you.
Speaker:I love your questions, so
Speaker:please do not hesitate if
Speaker:you have any and if you
Speaker:have any questions that are
Speaker:specific to your circumstance.
Speaker:In other words, you
Speaker:need some legal advice,
Speaker:book an errand call.
Speaker:I look forward to
Speaker:hearing from you.
